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Hey if you would like to shoot me over a free Kindle version I would be happy to look it over.
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Hey if you would like to shoot me over a free Kindle version I would be happy to look it over.
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So the statements in your article are incorrect. As long as I view it your way we can get along. Got it.
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Who said subordinate or seconds class? If you claim there will be a earthly temple then I can imagine there being physical laws that it requires.
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I'll check. Didn't see it when I just looked.
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Galatians 4:21
Hagar and Sarah
21 Tell me, you who want to be under the law, are you not aware of what the law says? 22 For it is written that Abraham had two sons, one by the slave woman and the other by the free woman. 23 His son by the slave woman was born according to the flesh, but his son by the free woman was born as the result of a divine promise.
24 These things are being taken figuratively: The women represent two covenants. One covenant is from Mount Sinai and bears children who are to be slaves: This is Hagar. 25 Now Hagar stands for Mount Sinai in Arabia and corresponds to the present city of Jerusalem, because she is in slavery with her children. 26 But the Jerusalem that is above is free, and she is our mother. 27 For it is written:
“Be glad, barren woman,
you who never bore a child;
shout for joy and cry aloud,
you who were never in labor;
because more are the children of the desolate woman
than of her who has a husband.”[a]
28 Now you, brothers and sisters, like Isaac, are children of promise. 29 At that time the son born according to the flesh persecuted the son born by the power of the Spirit. It is the same now. 30 But what does Scripture say? “Get rid of the slave woman and her son, for the slave woman’s son will never share in the inheritance with the free woman’s son.” 31 Therefore, brothers and sisters, we are not children of the slave woman, but of the free woman.
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Interesting.
This all completely describes the dynamics of a plural house. Wives thinking there way is right and a husband having to deal with it.
Agree. We can talk later.
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@PeteR , I don't have Amazon prime and so I downloaded the sample. From your introduction it appears your audience is in fact the so called Torah Awakening crowd that only really defines those who are more aligned with Judah. I don't dispute.
The second thing is, to this day I will walk out of a church when the preacher begins his sermon with a sports analogy.
I still ask the question, I accept you belief, do you accept mine?
We each come to our conclusions and each sees the other wrong, that's not the point. I can say your wrong about your belief just as much as you can say I am about mine.
The point you seem to be making is that we being different but still of the house of God should get along. But yet it still appears to me that from your point of view, again I say, we can get along as long as we do it your way.
Do you accept my belief we are different brides and God deals with each of us differently yes or no?
The second thing is, to this day I will walk out of a church when the preacher begins his sermon with a sports analogy.
I still ask the question, I accept you belief, do you accept mine?
We each come to our conclusions and each sees the other wrong, that's not the point. I can say your wrong about your belief just as much as you can say I am about mine.
The point you seem to be making is that we being different but still of the house of God should get along. But yet it still appears to me that from your point of view, again I say, we can get along as long as we do it your way.
Do you accept my belief we are different brides and God deals with each of us differently yes or no?
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Neither of you accepts each other’s beliefs.
What is the point?
I don’t accept a lot of the beliefs that people hold on this site, I don’t even accept all of Pete’s.
But I get along with him just fine.
Ephesians 4:3 (KJV) Endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace.
4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
What is the point?
I don’t accept a lot of the beliefs that people hold on this site, I don’t even accept all of Pete’s.
But I get along with him just fine.
Ephesians 4:3 (KJV) Endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace.
4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
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You are correct but I have also noticed that sometimes you voice you opinion about the difference. All good.
The point here is the article and idea of us, the two brides ofGod getting along and trying to find common ground to do so.
@Cap, I'm not sure you're asking the right question. Accepting a belief sounds like agreeing with it. I don't think either of you accepts the others' belief on this issue, and you don't have to to remain brothers.
Perhaps the better question is "Do you accept (respect, love, etc.) ME if I don't espouse a similar belief as yours?"
If the answer is no, then you would have cause for concern.
I'm not a whole Torah keeper, but I love my brethren who are. I often envy their discipline. @PeteR seems to be one of the reasonable Torah following chaps. I've seen some pretty unreasonable ones around here in my time.
Feel free to keep up the dialogue as long as it stays grounded in love.
Perhaps the better question is "Do you accept (respect, love, etc.) ME if I don't espouse a similar belief as yours?"
If the answer is no, then you would have cause for concern.
I'm not a whole Torah keeper, but I love my brethren who are. I often envy their discipline. @PeteR seems to be one of the reasonable Torah following chaps. I've seen some pretty unreasonable ones around here in my time.
Feel free to keep up the dialogue as long as it stays grounded in love.
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You may be correct about the position of the question and I too want very much for this discussion to be based on love particularly in a thread trying to find a way to hold all things in common.
As I have repeatedly said on many occasions, past and present, that I respect the belief of those who try to follow Torah to thier understanding and I would also bless them on thier journey. The problem is that when the question is turned around it is difficult for a Torah follower to admit that a non Torah follower is just as valued before God as they are, which in turn invalidates thier attempt if they do. Hence, the reason for my question, do you accept me in my belief and my relationship to God in it? And believe that I am right standing before God in it? They don't have to believe what I believe just accept it as my belief and not try and imply it's wrong. (I keep saying me or my but in reality there is a whole other world that believes like I do so I am not alone)
The real issue here is the constant Torah proselytizing that goes on and when a thought is brought forth to counter it, it some how turns into an attack on the Torah follower. Not at all meant, but it would seem that that sort of thing should go on in private or at least in the category for Jewish thought that's is designated on this forum. ( @PeteR you most admit you do try to push your belief as much and as often as you can.)
I would love to hear from non Torah followers on this matter. Do you think I am being unrealistic?
But that's true of all human endeavors. The church included. So I'm not sure how that's an argument against holding things in common.
I suspect Abraham is Biblical example of a family based patriarchal all things in common.
That little disagreement with Lot about the separate flocks seems to indicate otherwise.
I have Prime, but I only see the paperback version. Do you have a link to the kindle version?
It might be a fun project to see whose beliefs match exactly with whoever else on here.
I think the resulting exact matches might equal ... zero.
