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Making Progress on the church acceptance front

I never go there anymore, but we will someday, and I'll get Kristin to give her a closer look. She says she never noticed her. Also, not a girl, as I would estimate her age to be late 30s to early 50s.
 
Booted out.jpg

Time to start a new chapter with a new church that my older son won't hate, and that we won't have to drive so far to get to (40 minutes away). I got just the church in mind. My absence from that church, is on their terms, not mine, which is how I wanted it to be.

I'll see if this church down the street from us has an orchestra. Oh, and I have no intention to email the pastor if he speaks against polygamy the next time around. I don't intend to officially "join" the church either, at least not until they pester me to death to do so. They are going to have to really want to have me join before I give them any reason to contact my now "former" church. In the coming weeks and months, I will see if anybody there at that church is disgruntled enough to think about coming to the new church.

Oh and time to check one nice lovely lady off the list, although if she ever changes her mind...OK, I won't hold my breath on that one, but she does know how to reach me if she does, and I didn't waste any more time trying to woo her, than I needed to.

For your amusement, I will copy the email I received, and submit it here, after I have removed the name of the lady that he mentions in the email.
 
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Sadly, that was the response that I think most of us expected. Still, I’m sorry to see that’s the outcome. And for what it’s worth, my personal opinion is that you’re better off if that’s any consolation. “Churches” are so broken and far from the truth it’s ridiculous.
 
Email entitled "Inappropriate Behavior"

It ended up in my Spam folder, so he called me to see if I had gotten it.
___________________________________________________

To Daniel J DeLuca,


We were made aware of an e-mail (we have a copy) that you sent to <nice young lady> that was inappropriate and troubling. In NO WAY is this acceptable behavior nor will it be tolerated by the leadership of <church name>. <Lady's first name> was deeply disturbed as well.


You have shown that you will not respect the request of staff or lay leaders with regard to your propagating your belief in polygamy at <church name>. You met <Lady's first name> here at <church name>, you have pursued her here at <church name> and you hope to see her again at <church name>. Clearly disregarding what you have been asked repeatedly to do.


Because of your behavior you and sadly, your family, are NO LONGER WELCOME at <church name> or the <name of the other campus> campuses. Effective immediately we insist that you and your family DO NOT come to <church name> or the <name of the other campus> for any activities or be on the premises.


Additionally on <Lady's first name>’s behalf and at her request, DO NOT reach out to her again in any way, personally or through email.


We take no joy in this action but YOU have left us no choice.



<church name> Executive Staff and Leadership Team
 
I suppose I ought to include the "inappropriate" and "troubling" email, so you can judge for yourselves, with names removed of course.
 
Daniel DeLuca said:
I suppose I ought to include the "inappropriate" and "troubling" email, so you can judge for yourselves, with names removed of course.
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...or not....maybe later, when I am not so emotionally invested in it.
 
It was strong of you to share that rejection letter, but take your time showing us what you wrote her. We're in no hurry, and many of us have similar stories to tell. The ruling class defends the status quo at every turn, and that is what most churches are: exclusive clubs that encourage you to join, only to then regularly remind you that they can kick you back out again.
 
Keith Martin said:
The ruling class defends the status quo at every turn, and that is what most churches are: exclusive clubs that encourage you to join, only to then regularly remind you that they can kick you back out again.
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This is what is mentioned in Rev as the deeds of the nicolaitans as I recall.

The rule of the clergy over the laity.....as opposed to rule of law.

Shake the dust off @Daniel DeLuca and may you find a place with like minds!
 
Daniel DeLuca said:
Email entitled "Inappropriate Behavior"

It ended up in my Spam folder, so he called me to see if I had gotten it.
___________________________________________________

To Daniel J DeLuca,


We were made aware of an e-mail (we have a copy) that you sent to <nice young lady> that was inappropriate and troubling. In NO WAY is this acceptable behavior nor will it be tolerated by the leadership of <church name>. <Lady's first name> was deeply disturbed as well.


You have shown that you will not respect the request of staff or lay leaders with regard to your propagating your belief in polygamy at <church name>. You met <Lady's first name> here at <church name>, you have pursued her here at <church name> and you hope to see her again at <church name>. Clearly disregarding what you have been asked repeatedly to do.


Because of your behavior you and sadly, your family, are NO LONGER WELCOME at <church name> or the <name of the other campus> campuses. Effective immediately we insist that you and your family DO NOT come to <church name> or the <name of the other campus> for any activities or be on the premises.


Additionally on <Lady's first name>’s behalf and at her request, DO NOT reach out to her again in any way, personally or through email.


We take no joy in this action but YOU have left us no choice.



<church name> Executive Staff and Leadership Team
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I’m very sorry to hear her reaction.
 
What do I say. @Daniel DeLuca, do you want me to make meaningless sympathetic noises, or tell you what I really think? Pick which you want to hear and just read that bit. It depends if you want to learn from this or not.

Proverbs 27:6 "Faithful are the wounds of a friend; but the kisses of an enemy are deceitful."

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1) Meaningless noises:
Sorry to hear it turned out that way, I hope you find another church soon.

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2) What I'm actually thinking while making those noises:
I'll hide that in a quote so you won't see it unless you actually choose to read it.
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Honestly, I think this is the first time someone here has been kicked out of a church where I actually sympathise more with the church than the person getting booted.

Many of us have been kicked out of churches simply because of our theological views differing from the mainstream. That is unfair and unreasonable, for many reasons.

But you on the other hand were NOT kicked out for your differing theological viewpoint. Your church was unusually accommodating, only telling you not to try and promote your views there and stopping you from having any official roles, but permitting you to continue to attend. This was so generous that you yourself called this discussion "making progress on the church acceptance front" - this was not going in the direction of rejection, but rather acceptance.

You have now been kicked out NOT for believing in polygamy, but rather for making unwelcome advances to a young lady who found your advances creepy enough that she complained to the church leadership. Note that this won't be just over one email, the fact that she refused to give you her phone number in the first place (which is NOT normal) showed she was already uncomfortable about you. The email will have been the last straw, not the sole problem. Honestly, if there was a man who was approaching the ladies at ANY church - even a polygamous one - in a way that made them feel uncomfortable, they could expect to be told to leave. Just as you have been now. If someone was making the ladies uncomfortable even at a BF retreat they'd probably be told not to come back. This is the normal, understandable reaction of ANY church leader, and is motivated solely by concern for the women in their congregation.

It was very obvious right from the start of you talking about this young lady that she was not keen on you contacting her and that this was a likely outcome, which is exactly why most of us have been discouraging you rather than encouraging you:
FollowingHim said:
We are not trying to boost your confidence, because you already seem to have more than enough. And because in this case the consequences of over-confidence are much more serious. We want to help you find the right woman at the right time. Not give you the over-confidence to hit on church ladies until you and your wife are kicked out of all fellowship.
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I am most sorry for your wife. You might have been expecting to be booted from this church eventually, so have been happy to push the envelope until that occurred. You may have even at some level deliberately pushed it to this point to achieve martyrdom. But I highly doubt she is happy about the result, and I fear you have done this without taking sufficient account of her feelings and need for fellowship.

You are not a martyr who has been mistreated and booted from a church over polygamy. You were treated unusually generously by your church, yet chose not to appreciate that generosity, but rather to take advantage of it by making advances on a woman in that congregation. You have entirely brought this upon yourself.

Furthermore, you have made life MORE DIFFICULT for anybody else who believes in polygamy. The leadership at your old church will now think they know, from experience, that if they allow somebody who believes in polygamy to remain in their fellowship they will end up a potential danger to the ladies. You have confirmed for those church leaders that they were right to oppose polygamy. Any future person in that congregation who starts to think polygamy is ok will get the boot much faster as a direct result of your idiocy, to pre-emptively protect the ladies. You have in your own small way made life slightly more difficult for us all.

I have no sympathy for you at all, but enormous sympathy for your long-suffering wife.

It's high time for you to start learning wisdom.
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Daniel DeLuca said:
We take no joy in this action but YOU have left us no choice.
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Yeah right! Chapter and verse for that, please?

It's very sad but not new. Just a heads-up now they've done that. Keep your wife close. Don’t be surprised if those well meaning and dear folks try to destroy your relationship with her because you are such a wicked man. Shalom brother.
 
We have already been invited to attend another church. I politely declined the invitation, when I first received it, but I am now accepting the invitation.
 
eye4them said:
I agree with @frederick .. Keep your wife really close. Iirc, Mark C had a bad experience with others driving a wedge between him and one of his wives.
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I know Mark's story. I spent some time with him at the last summer retreat that we had.
 
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