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So you want to be an alpha male?

I actually like the Alpha male term. To me, a true biblical Christian man is an Alpha male! To live in His grace and walk in His path takes solid strength, courage and conviction that only few men have. To be an Alpha male involves bravely rejecting this modern feminist concept that we should be somehow not be assertive, and not pursue what we want. I define being an Alpha male differently, in that it involves everything being a real man should be. The concepts from Robert Lewis' book work well for me to define what a true Alpha male should be: Reject passivity, Accept responsibility, Lead courageously, Expect the greater reward (God's reward).

In my opinion, the true Alpha male is a leader, and the most true is a man of The Lord. He gains his following not by force or coersion, but by the grace of those who choose to follow him. This comes about by good leadership and responsible stewardship of those he has under his protection.
 
Every sub-community within the wider manosphere seems to have its own understanding of what an alpha male is. A lot of it is context dependent, whatever the community values/strives for they define as alpha; even as they use the term in different contexts.
 
rockfox said:
Every sub-community within the wider manosphere seems to have its own understanding of what an alpha male is. A lot of it is context dependent, whatever the community values/strives for they define as alpha; even as they use the term in different contexts.
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Agreed, which is why I won't argue with @Russell, for example, over his use of the term as he explains his understanding of it. Or @steve, etc. (steve, I appreciate your detailing some of the assertions in the video, helps provide context for me.)

For me, based on most of my interactions with people outside of this website, I see the term alpha being used as a badge (look at me, I'm an alpha) or as a putdown (look at him, he's a beta). For me, "alpha male" is a tautology and "beta male" is an oxymoron.

Question: Does anyone on purpose and proudly identify as a beta male? Or is that jargon even used outside the "I'm and alpha and you aren't" or "You and I are alphas and they're not" schools of thought?
 
I don't use these terms in my daily life and find those who feel the need to use them perhaps questioning their own manhood, or maybe not really understanding it to begin with.

But

I am proudly beta where I am called to be a beta (serving my master at work, or obeying those who have the rule over me in church).
 
I haven't watched the video yet, but for me, I see alpha and beta (at least as it is often popularly presented) as being a false dichotomy for Christians.

Alpha is the stereotypical "bad boy": confident and dominant, but arrogant and selfish. Beta is the stereotypical "nice guy": always trying to please others, but a wimpy pushover. These are sometimes viewed as two disjoint sets, or perhaps two ends of a continuum. From a Biblical POV, both sides have a good quality, and a bad quality, which means that a Christian shouldn't be either.

The way I view it is as two orthogonal axes. Along the horizontal x-axis is (selfish <-----> benevolent), and along the vertical y-axis is (timid <-----> confident). The alpha is in the top-left corner (confident, selfish) while the beta is in the lower right (timid, benevolent). The trick is to get to the upper right corner, where you are both confident and benevolent.

PUAs/MGTOWs often describe confidence as operating within your own "frame" instead of someone else's frame, but this causes selfishness, as you view your own frame as more important than others. In order to cultivate both qualities (a selfless confidence) you need to operate, not within your own frame -- much less within another person's frame, but within God's frame. Jesus and the apostles provide really good practical examples of this.

TLDR, the alpha/beta distinction forces an artificial choice between love and boldness, when Christians are to display both.
 
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Mojo said:
I am proudly beta where I am called to be a beta (serving my master at work, or obeying those who have the rule over me in church).
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I totally get what you're saying and totally agree. I just can't separate submission to authority from having real delegated authority (see, e.g., Mt 8:9), so I would not use alpha language to describe the authority I have been delegated or beta language to describe my submission to God's authority.
 
Shibboleth said:
The way I view it is as two orthogonal axes. Along the horizontal x-axis is (selfish <-----> benevolent), and along the vertical y-axis is (timid <-----> confident). The alpha is in the top-left corner (confident, selfish) while the beta is in the lower right (timid, benevolent). The trick is to get to the upper right corner, where you are both confident and benevolent.
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Nicely put.

Shibboleth said:
TLDR, the alpha/beta distinction forces an artificial choice between love and boldness, when Christians are to display both.
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And nicely summarized! :cool:
 
This terminology has my head swimming. I don't generally use it, so maybe I don't understand it fully.

Bottom line for me:
Where I am called to lead, or where there is a vacuum of leadership that needs to be filled, I will apply those skills and techniques that a godly leader needs to display (call that alpha or whatever anyone wants to call it).

Where I am not asked or expected to lead, nor is there a need for a leader, then I either submit to the established authority, or blend to work cooperatively (call that beta or whatever others call it).

Organizational leadership is exhausting, so I tend to steer clear of it unless called upon or led to it. Family leadership is just as exhausting, but generally much more rewarding. I like to focus on that.
 
Mojo said:
Organizational leadership is exhausting, so I tend to steer clear of it unless called upon or led to it. Family leadership is just as exhausting, but generally much more rewarding. I like to focus on that.
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Good point about leadership, ties in with your 'servant leadership' comment above. Bottom line is: Do I want the authority because of what I think is in it for me, or am I willing to take responsibility because I care deeply about them?
 
andrew said:
Good point about leadership, ties in with your 'servant leadership' comment above. Bottom line is: Do I want the authority because of what I think is in it for me, or am I willing to take responsibility because I care deeply about them?
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Which goes back to Type A personalities.

Is it all about ME? Or is it all about US or THEM?

I am not an America basher by any stretch of the imagination, but so much of our American Christian ideal is the Lone Ranger or Davey Crocket mindset. Scripture is much more cooperative than most of us care to acknowledge. We often forget about the barn raising phenomenon in American history. Cooperation and collaboration is not an evil, antiChrist, Communist conspiracy. What's best for all of US is generally going to be good for ME too.
 
Athol Kay has a view that's similar to Shibboleth's above.
Athol Kay said:
There are two primary needs a woman seeks being met from a man, before she can feel both sexually interested in him, and comfortable in allowing herself to actually have sex with him.

The Alpha Traits are those associated with classic “manly man” strengths. Power, dominance, physical ability, bravery, wealth, cool and confidence. Oh and good genes. These are the things that attract women and turn them on sexually. The Alpha Traits are linked to the dopamine response in women.

Dopamine is a neurotransmitter that is the “behavior reward” messenger in our brains. If anything feels good or is fun, it means there’s some dopamine involved. Dopamine is also responsible for the highly addictive effects of drugs like cocaine and other addictions like gambling, shopping, eating and sex. Dopamine encourages risky behavior and is the neurotransmitter that makes us feel “in love.”

The Beta Traits are those associated with the strengths of being a nice guy / “family man”. Kindness, being a good listener, the ability to help with the children, dependability, thoughtfulness, compassion and patience. These all create a sense of comfort and safety for the woman, and relax her because she feels that if she became pregnant, the Beta Trait male isn’t going to abandon her and the baby.

The hormone oxytocin is linked heavily to the response to the Beta Traits. Oxytocin makes women feel “loved” and creates trust and empathy for others. For example there is a massive oxytocin release during child birth that bonds a mother to her new baby. Oxytocin is also released during orgasm and bonds a woman to her partner.

So Alpha Traits create attraction and that “in love” feeling, and Beta Traits create the pair bond and makes her feel relaxed enough to have sex. You need a balance of both Alpha and Beta in a marriage to maximize her desire to have sex with you.
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Yikes Mystic. Where do you find this stuff? Sounds totally legit. Links? Reference?
 
This conversation reminds me of the MGTOW conversation where everyone is coming at it from different angles and different experiences.

It is true that everyone thinks of themselves as alpha, and no one identifies with beta because of judgment associated. On the other hand it is also true that every man has various levels of leadership in them.

And I think it is also true that leadership, and in particular leadership among men, is an attractive characteristic to women.

It is not really new info. Think back of the old Charles Atlas advertisement. Or the Back to the Future movies where the Dad is a wimp in the bad outcome futures but he is a confident self-controlled guy in the good outcome futures.

Basically, the PUA guys found out that this is still basically true, and that women still want this despite all of the modern talk of "toxic masculinity".

Further they found out that you can work on and improve in this area. Some ways it is just common sense things, like a firm handshake and looking the other man in the eye.

Or the square in the video, for example (which I found highly interesting and amusing). No one listened to the squeaky voice guy, but everyone listened to the man who talked slowly with a lower voice (this also comes out of the parenting 101 manual). Lower your voice if you want to command. It was a lesson I learned in the Navy.

Another thing to understand that these are all just factors, one of many. For example, as the video says, size helps. But clearly it is not the only factor, otherwise Andre the Giant would have been President of the US.

It is also, well known that short men have a major hurdle to overcome. Women, in general, do not like to be with men who are shorter than they are. That is just the way it is.

So what to make of all of this?

I think it is useful. If you want to more of a man among men. If you want to be more of a leader. If you want to be more attractive to women. This is helpful knowledge.

And while the PUA community discovered or re-discovered a lot of this stuff, clearly the application goes beyond simple pickup. It can be used in a business setting to get yourself viewed as more of a leader. It can make you more attractive to women, or to your wife. It is in effect basically in any social setting.

Is it important?

I think there are clearly other things more important such as character and integrity (referred to as "inner game" in the PUA community).

I would liken this to Moses and Aaron. Moses had the character and the integrity and God chose him as a leader. Unfortunately Moses did not have game and deferred to Aaron. Clearly the character and the integrity were the important part, but it might have been better for him if in addition he had his own game and not had to defer to his brother.

Note: I am aware that I used game here as a synonym for confidence, which is probably the #1 factor in game.

 
cnystrom said:
Lower your voice if you want to command.
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This works for women as well. Betty Joan Perske had a high-pitched nasal voice until she got signed to the movies and got a major makeover, including voice coaching to train her to lower her voice to the sultry altro we associate with Lauren Bacall.
 
And on the flipside, when you hear male feminists on youtube (not recommended), they often talk in a higher-pitched, fast-paced voice.
 
andrew said:
For me, based on most of my interactions with people outside of this website, I see the term alpha being used as a badge (look at me, I'm an alpha) or as a putdown (look at him, he's a beta). For me, "alpha male" is a tautology and "beta male" is an oxymoron.
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Males will turn anything into a competition. It is so ingrained into us it starts young (my Dad's tougher than your Dad). But the alpha/beta analogy has helped a lot of men improve themselves and fix what the culture has done to them.

The simplistic alpha good beta bad perspective was only the primitive start. The concept has evolved a lot and became much more sophisticated with time.
 
andrew said:
This works for women as well. Betty Joan Perske had a high-pitched nasal voice until she got signed to the movies and got a major makeover, including voice coaching to train her to lower her voice to the sultry altro we associate with Lauren Bacall.
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That and two packs of unfiltered Lucky Strikes every day.....:D
 
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