Palestine in Israel

[MemeFan]

We are still living in the worldwide system of Babylon. The mother Harlot is still reigning on earth along with all her daughters. His law is not preached throughout the nations:

Isaiah 2:3
People from many nations will come and say, “Come, let us go up to the mountain of Yahuah, to the house of Jacob’s Elohim. There he will teach us his ways, and we will walk in his paths.” For Yahuah’s law will go out from Zion; his word will go out from Jerusalem.

4 …. Nation will no longer fight against nation,
nor train for war anymore.

We are living in an age where the law is not just ignored - but it’s spit on. Case in point - a pastor would clear any rapist if the victim was wearing seducing clothing:

Fury at Pastor who said he'd clear rapists if victim was scantily-clad

Pastor Bobby Leonard said that he would clear a rapist of charges if the victim was wearing shorts as 'a man's a man' during a sermon at the Bible Baptist Tabernacle church in Monroe, North Carolina

www.dailymail.co.uk

It’s pure lawlessness. Even if she was butt naked, and threw herself at you - if she’s engaged or married to another man - you RUN. Like Jospeh ran in Egypt. Otherwise, you’re guilty of adultery, and that comes with a promise of destruction. The Egyptian Pharaoh in Abram’s time had a better understanding of adultery than “Christian pastors” that went to Bible college.

———————————————————
So is there a conspiracy? Of course - there is. Just read the scriptures. Babylon is still ruling on earth. The mother of abominations. She has not been judged yet - nor her daughters - nor her people. She is teaching your children in school. She is teaching your pastors in her Bible colleges. At the same time - she’s feeding you gmo poison for food, and contaminating your water. Charging you as much tax she can get away with - so the people can be her slaves working until old age kicks in. So why would I trust the system of Babylon to give me accurate locations? Did they do something to earn that trust - or have they’ve repeatedly lied over and over?

If Israel is the true location and its people were true Israelites (As Paul says - you’re not a Jew because you were born to Jewish parents) - why would our (Babylon) government send them billions and billions in aid? When have you’ve seen America or Europe choose Torah instructions over Babylon’s instructions?

So why would Biden want to send billions to Israel? We are all still in exile. Judah and Israel. The True Restoration promised over and over in the scriptures - hasn’t happened yet.

And exactly who are members of conspiracy and are they hiding stuff? Think a little. And how do you know conspiracy is active now?

And why Babylon must be active now? Or be a conspiracy?

I think you need blessings of doubt. It would make you less certain and more willing to explore. It would make closer to truth.

You have been on this forum for some time. My observation is that you have tendecy to claim something is true for things that are brutally hard to prove. And when somebody here finds fault with your idea, you dig in even harder.

This isn't good dynamics. It causes feeling in you that nobody believes you and only you know truth. Situation not helped with belief that Bible is absolutely certain.* End result is that nobody can correct you.

And with passage of time situation will get worse. You will get even worse ideas causing others to disregard you and you feeling as holder of truth. It's path to societal isolation and even darker paths.

* There is no sign I see in you: maybe my understanding is wrong.

 

[OttoM]

But if you do not know where Israel was, how can you say Asia and Europe are north of it?

And what are the limits? What information is not from Babylon and is usable?

If the promise land covered Central/East Africa - north of that is Europe/Asia. If the promise covered Palestine area - north of that is still Asia/europe.

We have the scriptures - if the adversary had complete control - we wouldn’t have the scriptures at all. But as it stands - we have the scriptures - albeit not the best translations, and some are clearly deliberate. But those that study and seek - can uncover some of the lies and deception. Such as polygyny being righteous and good - along with monogamy.

 

[OttoM]

I understand your answer but it’s not an answer to my question. I’ll ask clearly.

Are you a black Hebrew Israelite?

No I’m a white American - from Eastern Europe.

 

[OttoM]

But if you do not know where Israel was, how can you say Asia and Europe are north of it?

And what are the limits? What information is not from Babylon and is usable?

Isaiah 61:4
And they shall build the old waste places, they shall raise up those that were before made desolate, and shall renew the desert cities, even those that had been desolate for many generations

6 But ye shall be called priests of Yahuah, the ministers of Elohim: ye shall eat the strength of nations, and shall be admired because of their wealth.

7 Thus shall they inherit the land a second time, and everlasting joy shall be upon their head.

8 For I am Yahuah who love righteousness, and hate robberies of injustice; and I will give their labour to the just, and will make an everlasting covenant with them.

10 and they shall greatly rejoice in Yahuah. Let my soul rejoice in Yahuah; for he has clothed me with the robe of salvation, and the garment of joy: he has put a mitre on me as on a bridegroom, and adorned me with ornaments as a bride.

11 And as the earth putting forth her flowers, and as a garden its seed; so shall Yahuah, even Yahuah, cause righteousness to spring forth, and exultation before all nations.

— this is the LXX English translation. The Masoretic text does not use the word “second” but instead double.

According to the LXX - when the 2nd exodus happens - the land is a wasteland. At least parts have been that way for many generations. Therefore, the exodus of the Jews (it didn’t even include the 10 lost tribes - because the true exodus includes BOTH Israel and Judah) to Palestine does not fit with scripture. It’s not the land because it wasn’t desolate. If it becomes desolate in the future due to war with Islam - then there would still need to pass “many generations” before the true exodus occurs in that land. I don’t see this prolonging that much longer - considering the lawlessness that’s already happening.

 

[OttoM]

And why Babylon must be active now? Or be a conspiracy?

Isaiah 46:7
They carry it around on their shoulders, and when they set it down, it stays there. It can’t even move! And when someone prays to it, there is no answer. It can’t rescue anyone from trouble.



Jeremiah 44:19
Besides,” the women added, “do you suppose that we were burning incense and pouring out liquid offerings to the Queen of Heaven, and making cakes marked with her image, without our husbands knowing it and helping us? Of course not!”



1 Kings 13:33
But even after this, Jeroboam did not turn from his evil ways. He continued to choose priests from the common people. He appointed anyone who wanted to become a priest for the pagan shrines.

Anyone can become a priest in the Roman Catholic Church. Even if you’re a homosexual and have a history of sexually abusing children. They will especially take care of you. The law says tribe of levites.

Christians are the lost sheep of the Northern Kingdom of Israel. Doing the same exact sins that caused the “exile” of the 10 tribes of Israel many years ago.

The Protestants aren’t off the hook - because those are the daughters of the Roman Catholic Church - and the mother teaches their pastors through her Bible colleges - and the pastors in turn teach their own Protestant denominations to practice lawlessness.

 

[OttoM]

Isaiah 10:22
And though the people of Israel be as the sand of the sea, only a remnant of them shall be saved.

Isaiah 65:8-9
But I will not destroy them all, says Yahuah. For just as good grapes are found among a cluster of bad ones (and someone will say, ‘Don’t throw them all away— some of those grapes are good!’), so I will not destroy all Israel. For I still have true servants there. 9 I will preserve a remnant of the people of Israel and of Judah to possess my land. Those I choose will inherit it, and my servants will live there.

It's a unfulfilled prophecy of judgement, and restoration. When you realize who "Israel" really is, then it starts making sense why the adversary would create a country called Israel in Palestine. Most christians reading these verses don't realize it's referring to them, but instead they believe it's the Jews living in Palestine. So they gloss over it. Just read Isaiah 65 in full - the Creator lists some of their sins. Do the Jews in Palestine eat swine flesh? Use pagan altars? Worship the dead? Are their numbers like the sand on the seashore? None of these things apply to the great majority of the Jews in Palestine. But there are two billion catholics that do those things. There are many protestants that walk in their own ways - in lawlessness - because their 501 c(3) pastors preached to them that the Creator's Laws were the problem - even though the law will go forth from Zion to all the nations during the everlasting peace covenant.

When Paul is talking about "All Israel" being saved. He's not talking about the "broods of vipers." He's talking about the two divided kingdoms - Israel (North) and Judah (South). Which occurs in the end times. Israel and Judah - the entire house of Jacob (Israel) will be saved. They will be re-united into one kingdom. But it will only be a remnant. But from that remnant the Most High will bless and greatly multiply his people:

Isaiah 60:22
The smallest family will become a thousand people, and the tiniest group will become a mighty nation. At the right time, I, Yahuah, will make it happen.

Isaiah 2:3
People from many nations will come and say, “Come, let us go up to the mountain of Yahuah, to the house of Jacob’s (Israel's) Elohim. There he will teach us his ways, and we will walk in his paths.” For Yahuah's law will go out from Zion; his word will go out from Jerusalem.

 

[MemeFan]

Isaiah 46:7
They carry it around on their shoulders, and when they set it down, it stays there. It can’t even move! And when someone prays to it, there is no answer. It can’t rescue anyone from trouble.

View attachment 6455

Jeremiah 44:19
Besides,” the women added, “do you suppose that we were burning incense and pouring out liquid offerings to the Queen of Heaven, and making cakes marked with her image, without our husbands knowing it and helping us? Of course not!”


View attachment 6456
1 Kings 13:33
But even after this, Jeroboam did not turn from his evil ways. He continued to choose priests from the common people. He appointed anyone who wanted to become a priest for the pagan shrines.

Anyone can become a priest in the Roman Catholic Church. Even if you’re a homosexual and have a history of sexually abusing children. They will especially take care of you. The law says tribe of levites.

Christians are the lost sheep of the Northern Kingdom of Israel. Doing the same exact sins that caused the “exile” of the 10 tribes of Israel many years ago.

The Protestants aren’t off the hook - because those are the daughters of the Roman Catholic Church - and the mother teaches their pastors through her Bible colleges - and the pastors in turn teach their own Protestant denominations to practice lawlessness.

@Earth_is- ,

How about you spend time proving correct, but also "I just can't accept (like polygamy also)" doctrine of universal salvation (idea that Lord will save all (for real, including Hitler) just as said He would)?

It would be way more productive investment of time.

 

[FollowingHim]

We have the scriptures - if the adversary had complete control - we wouldn’t have the scriptures at all. But as it stands - we have the scriptures - albeit not the best translations, and some are clearly deliberate. But those that study and seek - can uncover some of the lies and deception. Such as polygyny being righteous and good - along with monogamy.

So, what books are the scriptures - which list of books do you take as authoritative (Protestant, Catholic, Orthodox or something else)?

And on whose authority do you believe that set of books are from God? Did you learn that from somewhere?

I'm not disagreeing with you, I'm encouraging you to think a bit more about this, for reasons.

 

[OttoM]

So, what books are the scriptures - which list of books do you take as authoritative (Protestant, Catholic, Orthodox or something else)?

And on whose authority do you believe that set of books are from God? Did you learn that from somewhere?

I'm not disagreeing with you, I'm encouraging you to think a bit more about this, for reasons.

The Scriptures I found are the truth. When the Exodus occurs and the Creator's Law is preached throughout the nations - I believe even more glory is going to be given to the Most High. Because it will show a stark contrast between the laws and wisdom of men, and the Laws and Wisdom of the Most High. Praise YAH.

All the Scriptures that we have right now - the 66 books. Were there more books but removed? Yes - I do believe there were more books - because it's possible one apostle was quoting the book of Enoch in terms of there being some angels locked up in prison. However, since that book has been removed - which I believe the Most High allowed it to be removed - I can no longer can trust the "Book of Enoch" we know of today. Since it was removed - I feel like its covering may of also been removed - therefore - it may be open to corruption. Kind of like a wife married to her husband - her covering. If she's no longer part of his covering - she's no longer part of his protection.

If the catholics had authority over the scriptures - wouldn't they had added things like - "Easter" is the official holiday of the church. "Sunday" is the official sabbath of the church. "Swine flesh" is allowed for the church. Mary is the "Queen of Heaven." You don't see any of this stuff. Which tells me they didn't have the authority - and there is a MUCH HIGHER POWER at work. They have to grossly twist the scriptures and then use quotes from "church fathers" 300 years after the apostles - for them to somehow convince the people of their man-made doctrines.

 

[FollowingHim]

All the Scriptures that we have right now - the 66 books.

So, the Protestant canon. Why not the 81 books of the Orthodox canon?

It's an important question when it comes to history, due to the books of Maccabees which fill the 400-year gap in history between the Old and New Testament in the Protestant Bible. Do you categorise the books of Maccabees as useful history, or a product of Babylon to be rejected?

 

[OttoM]

So, the Protestant canon. Why not the 81 books of the Orthodox canon?

It's an important question when it comes to history, due to the books of Maccabees which fill the 400-year gap in history between the Old and New Testament in the Protestant Bible. Do you categorise the books of Maccabees as useful history, or a product of Babylon to be rejected?

Did the LXX include those books? The original KJV included some additional books, but they were cut off in later additions. I wouldn’t reject them entirely. My suggestion is get very well acquainted with the 66 books. After that - if someone wants to read the additional books that the first edition of the KJV had - go ahead. But get your self very well grounded with the 66 books we currently have. Including the law and instructions - aka - Torah. Some of Paul’s letters can be difficult to understand without a firm upstanding in the law and instructions. He even writes, for example, “to those that know the law.” In Romans 7:1.

 

[FollowingHim]

Did the LXX include those books?

Yes. That's why they're in the Orthodox canon.

The Protestant bible only includes the books that the Masoretic Jews preserved Hebrew copies of. The Masoretic sect chose to reject certain books for their own reasons, but it has traditionally been believed that the entire LXX was originally Hebrew, and the Qumran scrolls have shown us that this is true for at least some of the additional books. It is debatable why the Masoretes removed these books, but it was a decision by them.

The Protestant reformers then took the list of books that the Masoretes had preserved as the only authoritative Old Testament books, becoming the Protestant Old Testament, and categorised the books that no Hebrew copies were available for as less reliable but still useful, becoming the Protestant Apocrypha. The Apocrypha then fell out of use over time as if it had been rejected entirely, which I do not believe was the original intent.

Anyway, the point is that you are using a Jewish selection of Old Testament books, and rejecting the additional books that were preserved by the Christian church.

Are you comfortable with this? Or do you think it may be helpful to have a better understanding of the history of the church?

 

[OttoM]

So, the Protestant canon. Why not the 81 books of the Orthodox canon?

It's an important question when it comes to history, due to the books of Maccabees which fill the 400-year gap in history between the Old and New Testament in the Protestant Bible. Do you categorise the books of Maccabees as useful history, or a product of Babylon to be rejected?

What do you think about the Talmud? What do you think about Christians being the lost sheep of Israel?

 

[OttoM]

Yes. That's why they're in the Orthodox canon.

The Protestant bible only includes the books that the Masoretic Jews preserved Hebrew copies of. The Masoretic sect chose to reject certain books for their own reasons, but it has traditionally been believed that the entire LXX was originally Hebrew, and the Qumran scrolls have shown us that this is true for at least some of the additional books. It is debatable why the Masoretes removed these books, but it was a decision by them.

The Protestant reformers then took the list of books that the Masoretes had preserved as the only authoritative Old Testament books, becoming the Protestant Old Testament, and categorised the books that no Hebrew copies were available for as less reliable but still useful, becoming the Protestant Apocrypha. The Apocrypha then fell out of use over time as if it had been rejected entirely, which I do not believe was the original intent.

Anyway, the point is that you are using a Jewish selection of Old Testament books, and rejecting the additional books that were preserved by the Christian church.

Are you comfortable with this? Or do you think it may be helpful to have a better understanding of the history of the church?

I don’t reject the additional books founds in orthodox or lxx. I said read the 66 books first. Get well grounded in Torah. Then read the other ones from LXX or orthodox.

 

[FollowingHim]

What do you think about the Talmud?

Similar to the Quran - a heretical writing based in part on the Old Testament scripture, so which will contain elements of truth but is ultimately designed to lead people away from Messiah. The Quran is similar, but based in part on the New Testament also, so does not entirely reject Messiah but rather distorts him.

What do you think about Christians being the lost sheep of Israel?

Basically everyone is Israel, genetically & statistically speaking. So anyone God calls to follow Him is a lost sheep of Israel.

I don’t reject the additional books founds in orthodox or lxx. I said read the 66 books first. Get well grounded in Torah. Then read the other ones from LXX or orthodox.

I take the same approach myself. My point is however deeper than that. You are taking by faith that these 66 books are correct, despite not understanding where they have come from. The books themselves have been selected by scholars whose reasoning and decisions are not recorded in the books themselves. By accepting these books, you are accepting the work of other scholars, scholars whose own writings you appear to reject as works of "babylon" given you reject everything other than scripture itself. You accept the books chosen by the church fathers, but reject everything else the church fathers say. I fail to see any logic here.

If everything other than scripture is "babylon", then even the selection of scripture itself has been done by "babylon", so even scripture is in doubt. Leaving absolutely nothing to believe at all.

I'm trying to point out that you are yourself basing your own views on extra-biblical scholarship.

Is that ok? (obviously, I say yes, I'm asking you)

 

[OttoM]

Similar to the Quran - a heretical writing based in part on the Old Testament scripture, so which will contain elements of truth but is ultimately designed to lead people away from Messiah. The Quran is similar, but based in part on the New Testament also, so does not entirely reject Messiah but rather distorts him.

Basically everyone is Israel, genetically & statistically speaking. So anyone God calls to follow Him is a lost sheep of Israel.

I take the same approach myself. My point is however deeper than that. You are taking by faith that these 66 books are correct, despite not understanding where they have come from. The books themselves have been selected by scholars whose reasoning and decisions are not recorded in the books themselves. By accepting these books, you are accepting the work of other scholars, scholars whose own writings you appear to reject as works of "babylon" given you reject everything other than scripture itself. You accept the books chosen by the church fathers, but reject everything else the church fathers say. I fail to see any logic here.

If everything other than scripture is "babylon", then even the selection of scripture itself has been done by "babylon", so even scripture is in doubt. Leaving absolutely nothing to believe at all.

I'm trying to point out that you are yourself basing your own views on extra-biblical scholarship.

Is that ok? (obviously, I say yes, I'm asking you)

If Babylon or the scholars that selected the 66 books had absolute free reign control, then why didn’t they include the following within the New Testament writings:

“Easter" is the official holiday of the church. "Sunday" is the official sabbath of the church. “Roman Catholic Church” is the offical church. "Swine flesh" is allowed for the church. Mary is the "Queen of Heaven." You don't see any of this stuff. Yet they shove it down your throat with extremely limited (usually by twisting) scripture to back it up.

Which tells me they had a limit - from a Higher Power. In the book of Job - we learn Satan needed permission from the Most High to inflict suffering on Job. The same logic, imo, would apply with our 66 books. I don’t doubt books were removed (LXX and orthodox). Obviously there have been deliberate mis translations. But those that worship in Spirit and Truth - humble and meek - accept correction - they can receive truth. I plan on reading the additional books found in LXX myself.

Now….. if they did include those things, which would had very clearly violated the Old Testament writings, instructions, and prophets - then I would have to reject the New Testament. But it doesn’t - even Paul - does not. He’s just difficult to understand - as Peter writes. For example - there is zero prophet that said anything about venerating or worshipping a “queen of heaven.” The few times a queen of heaven is mentioned - it’s in a negative context.

 

[FollowingHim]

Or there is a simpler explanation: "Babylon" did not select the books of the Bible at all, they were selected by the Body of Christ, the Church.

Why do you assume a more complicated explanation - "Babylon" selected the books of the Bible but God made it do what He wanted it to do - when a much simpler one is available?

 

[OttoM]

Or there is a simpler explanation: "Babylon" did not select the books of the Bible at all, they were selected by the Body of Christ, the Church.

Why do you assume a more complicated explanation - "Babylon" selected the books of the Bible but God made it do what He wanted it to do - when a much simpler one is available?

Yes, that’s a true possibility as well. Where are the original Hebrew Scriptures of the four gospels? Surely, they didn’t write it in Greek first. But in their own language and then translated into the Greek (which we have).

My assumption is they’ve hidden it - in order to hide the name of the Messiah. His name is not Iesus. Or Jesus. Or Christ. He came in his father’s name. The letter “j” didn’t even exist until recently.

John 5:43
For I have come to you in my Father’s name, and you have rejected me. Yet if others come in their own name, you gladly welcome them.

Why would the body of the Messiah - hide the Messiah’s own name? The name we must be saved under. From where did Iesus originate from? What does it mean in Hebrew? How does it relate to the name of the Father? Good questions to mediate on.

 

[FollowingHim]

Yes, that’s a true possibility as well. Where are the original Hebrew Scriptures of the four gospels? Surely, they didn’t write it in Greek first. But in their own language and then translated into the Greek (which we have).

Why would you assume that? Greek was the dominant language of the whole Roman Empire at the time, the most widely spoken language. The Gospels were intended for use by the entire Church, most of whom spoke Greek and only a fraction of whom spoke Hebrew.
1) Why do you say this? Is it your own reasoning of what you think you would have done if you were them based on your limited understanding of their situation, or based on evidence?
2) If evidence, what evidence?

 

[OttoM]

Why would you assume that? Greek was the dominant language of the whole Roman Empire at the time, the most widely spoken language. The Gospels were intended for use by the entire Church, most of whom spoke Greek and only a fraction of whom spoke Hebrew.
1) Why do you say this? Is it your own reasoning of what you think you would have done if you were them based on your limited understanding of their situation, or based on evidence?
2) If evidence, what evidence?

John 5:43
For I have come to you in my Father’s name, and you have rejected me. Yet if others come in their own name, you gladly welcome them.

From where did Iesus originate from? What does it mean in Hebrew? How does it relate to the name of the Father?