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chrisinmiddletn

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I am the worst person in the world to get in and stay in touch with people of like mindedness. We do fellowship with people but not with people from this board. It's mainly priorities and this is kind of low on the totem poll. That said, we are going on the Father/Daughter retreat with Vision Forum this weekend. Just wondering if anyone is going to be there? I doubt that to be the case but I figure I might as well try since I'll be down that way.
 
Also, I need to ammend this to see if anyone is involved with any ministries that probably cross our paths like Vision Forum, AIG, etc. Obviously, these ministries probably do not approve to our stance in this area but they do minister to us in our ministry to our children.
 
Well we're back and it was a great time. The biggest thing we were encouraged by were how many people there were that are dedicated to the Lord and the discipleship of their family. also, I want to apologize for talking saying AIG as I meant ATI. :P.

During the program, something was raised that queried an instant question in a "debate" that belongs in another thread here.

Lately, not to take away from Biblical Families, I'm curious about what other ministries people are involved in. I'm probably like you in that I'm not a one issue guy. I think that might help, at least me in part, to imagine a type of cohesion with others.
 
In terms of other ministries, I'm secretary and a regular preacher at an Open Brethren assembly. And a husband and father, which is a much bigger ministry! We're certainly not one-issue people either, even though it might look like it sometimes if you only read what we post on this forum. This just happens to be where we discuss polygamy.
 
I think you'll find that we're a varied bunch here. Wide range of thought around a number of things.
 
We can't afford the travel and conferences, and nobody comes near Maine too often, but we use a lot of Vision Forum resources also. We also use AiG material (noted your correction earlier) and NCFIC also. I know they don't see polygamy the way we do, but if they actually worked their way through their own methodology of doctrinal research, that might change a bit. At least they are very pro family, patriarchy, and most everything else we believe in.

It is interesting that those who proclaim the sufficiency of Scripture, or sola scriptura, would not be able to see that God's Word mentions and regulates polygamy all over the OT and references it in relation to Christ in the 10 virgins (that's how I see it, anywho) and yet Doug Philips plainly stated that Matthew 19 was his text to say poly was wrong. I wonder if he read that in light of a man who currently has multiple wives if he could say that Jesus obviously stated that such a man should not divorce his wife, as "What God has put together, let not man separate" :D

Anyway, I do appreciate their line of thinking on many things and see plural marriage as a blind spot. As it was also a blind spot for me for years, I think patience and prayer are a good course of action regarding these dear Christians. We would love to get to a conference, but we have a ton of their audio from conferences and download the daily freebies from Blue Behemoth and buy books and such when we have opportunity.
 
I don't see any issue with talking about areas of ministry folks are involved in. Our focus has been on the home, BF retreat plans (next month) and fellowship with local Christians. We do evangelism as a family mostly, though I used to organize and teach equipping workshops all over the US through the Open Plymouth Brethren. Now even the local liberal Baptists won't put up with us, but we still have quite a few families who we enjoy time with. Mostly other homeschool families and other friends who may not agree with us but have not abandoned us either.
 
Cow fam said:
I don't see any issue with talking about areas of ministry folks are involved in.
Click to expand...
Sir BumbleBerry wonders if he can have a ministry to Teddy Bears? :roll: He claims to be the one truly taking care of Cecil's famous bear, Freddie Teddy. :o

Cecil disputes the claim ... ;)
 
I just want to say thank you for all of your replies. We've been doing the stomach flu rounds in our large family (depends on your definition as we're not double digit yert but are getting fairly close to it) for the past two weeks which threw work and other life things into disarray. :P It is very good to see the other families here expresing very similar and varied interests. I think one of the things that VF has that has gathered interest is the every aspect of life effect. We have NCFIC, Good Samaritan, Ladies Against Feminism, the film festival, the Entrepeneur Bootcamps, and so and such forth. I'm not saying that this group is prepared to handle such aspects but it is definitely something that should be looked at as I believe the foundation (a truely Biblical Family) is stronger than their position.

Here's an area I would point to that would, in my opinion, is a need that would help build families in a Biblical fashion. Mind you, I come from a very patriarchal perspective. When I read 1 Corinthians 7:2, I don't use that for a polygynous argument. Instead, I focus on the nuances of own in respect to the responsibility of the husband and how he is held accountable to God. The polygyny argument, at that point, just naturally presents itself as the person accepts the meaning of the two Greek words over time. That said, there is a huge call for men to take care of widows and orphans. If I understand scripture correctly, a woman should always be under the guidance of man (her father, her husband or elders in the Church). This is the normative and thus it extends into the area of widowhood. If a husband dies, the womand should go back to her family (argument insues if that should happen if her family are composed of believers or not) and they should then find her a husband (yes, I believe in courtship). If the family is not available (and depending on where you stand on if they are believers - personally I would tend to say they are fairly disqualified), the Church should either take her in or find her a husband (age being the factor). That being said, I know of no ministry that takes this seriously. In my mind (being as flawed as it is), a body of believers should appoint men to help such families and find husbands for those wives. I know in my life, we're currently fine financially but what happens if I pass away on Biblical perspective? Who will wash my wife with the Word? Who will disciple my children? We're pretty much left in the cold on this. Given doctrinal differences, it would be ideal for a fund to be set up to not just financially take care of these families but to set up a means for those that are appointed to work towards their spriritual development and final transferrence to another head that is in line to the previous husband's convictions.

Another ministry would be to help enable families to have family businesses so that the husband is more active with the wife/wives and children. How many of us tend to just accept that some men should be away from the home and sometimes that the wife whould be away from the home under the authority of another man? Please forgive me if I just offended someone, it's just something I'm very passionate about and desire to help those families wanting to go towards those models.

Anyways, gotta go!
 
I have a similar perspective on these things Chris, well said. I don't think there is a need for a fund to be set up to help widows and orphans, that becomes too impersonal. Rather we should as a church be willing to rally around and help whenever someone in our midst is in that situation. And we should be looking to find them a husband / father if their family are unwilling or unable to.

I agree it is a concern what would happen following the death of one or both parents. My family is not double digits yet either, but is certainly growing. Once you get to a certain point it becomes rather difficult to expect relatives to take all the children and keep them together if both parents died. Raising them also becomes a major challenge for the remaining parent if only one parent dies.

Polygamy provides some insurance here, if there are three parents and one dies, at least there are two left to help each other raise the children. But in the event of the father being the one that died, the children would still be left with no male role model, and another husband is needed. The family and church still needs to step up and provide here.

Now, it would take a very dedicated man to step up to the challenge of suddenly taking on two wives and 16 children ranging in age from one to 23, in addition to his own wife and children, if a highly fertile local polygamist suddenly got hit by a bus... That might be extreme, but I think it's something each of us men should take a minute to think about. Are you REALLY willing to care for the widows and orphans? We should be.
 
Thank you for your response! I guess what I'm trying to address is several issues in proposing the fund (which goes beyond just monetary stuff).

1) It provides a safe framework by which the body can address the needs of widows rather than the "goodness" of the parishners. Acts 6 is the first example of this as men were selected to help take care of them. I would probably point to 1 Timothy 5 for the rules surrounding them.

2) It helps bring a mind of community as the concerns of a young patriarch is adddressed. My thoughts would be one a consistency of doctrinal standards that he feels impressed by the Lord to continue after his death (like a will but is a framework for elders - i.e. a covenant theologian probably would not enjoy an armenian directing his wife and children). Another is the continual guardianship over the family that the body does through that elder(s)/deacon(s) while they take on that role and in turn look for a more permanent "replacement" (sounds like a used car part -LOL).

3) Such a framework (fund and elders/deacons) could be used to help single women who are new to the faith and may or may not have children (needless to say their own framework of support). One of the worst things I could imagine if I ever decided to add a wife is to use the World's resources to find an extra wife. If I don't use that, what is the alternative? Wait until my buddy, the patriarch, or brother kills over and take his wife? I could imagine all sorts of thoughts if that became the standard practice of getting an additional wife and it might be cause for less fellowship. Hmmmm, why are they inviting us back over for BBQ? Is it because they enjoy my fellowship or because I told them that I have high colesterol? LOL. Instead, such a framework could be used to help disciple her instead of her feeling like a piece of meat (okay, I'm in this little cult but do they just want me as an extra wife or are they actually looking after my best interest). Through such a framework, people can prayerfully introduce her to families that might be a good fit while helping to protect her from ill-suited ones. If it was your daughter and everyone in your family was dead, what would you want? Would you want her face plastered on some polygynous singles board where the strange geeky guy that looks like a cross between Doc in Back to the Future and the Swamp Creature with visions of becoming the next Warren Jeffs could hook up with her and have tons of kids? Orrrrrrrrr, would you feel better if you had a framework to lean upon where people invested in her and prayerfully sought out a husband for her while protecting her heart because a Warren Jeffs Doc/Swamp Creature is soooooooo alluring to aching hearts. LOL Again I would use 1 Timothy 5 and Deuteronomy 27:19 as my framework in this.

The financial part comes in where we help the deacons/elders do their work. It is really too much to ask of one family to take on that of another family (or unexpected person). How many of us have a wife/wives working away from home when we are convicted that this is not the ideal according to the Word of God? How many of us men are working jobs away from home and not fully taking in the mandate given to us in Deuteronomy 6? Is it not human nature to then say "I would love to help out but I just didn't plan to have any money go to help this situation" or "Wow, a girl that is interested in polygyny. Maybe she's a marginal Christian that hates kids with suicidal tendancies but she's interested in becoming a sister wife! Hey honey! Get that extra room in our single wide ready and call wellfare to let them know we're adding a new name to the dole!". In the later, when emotions are involved (especially in executing a vision from God) we're all very subject to stupid (i.e. Abraham, Sarah and Hagar - yeah worked out reeeaaallll well). So I guess we should throw in accountability as extra benefit number 4.

Other verses that I think point to the responsibility of the Body doing this would be James 1:27 and Psalms 68:5.

Lastly, before raising up that I should do this, I'm fairly disqualified for this at this time. I'm fairly irresponsible with money (trying to get better at this) and though we live comfortably I would not trust myself with anything other than my money (which is the Lord's) because its accumulation was not by any craft of my own. I'm also completely and totally slammed to the point I can hardly get any time to post on a board to a group that I've been familiar with for the past 5 years (yeah, call me a lurker). It's just now that I've been able to do a couple of things! :P

Anywho, I've posted years eyes off so I'm going to post this without rereading/spellchecking it (we really need that as a function on this board - rereading bot as I'm a perfect spell checker - LOL).
 
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